Who better to speak English, Spanish or Italian?


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Hi,

this is now my 4th vacation in Spain. Now spent almost 40 days there.

What strikes me every time there is that the locals, regardless of whether they are 16 or 66, have absolutely no or very poor knowledge of English.

Why is that Here in Germany, English can already be learned in elementary school ...

Then I compare the whole thing with the Nordic countries, especially Sweden - the boys there can all speak English at a super-high level ..

Ideas?

In France, by the way, the same thing .. The boys aged 16-26 can hardly speak a word of English.

If I go over the border to Amsterdam .. everyone can speak English there ..

It's amazing how badly it fails because of European integration in language :(

They consider their language to be a world language that you have to be able to kindly. Especially the French are really bad there .. I can also ask them to learn German, after all, it was all German: D

in France the language is consciously promoted. http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loi_Toubon

on the subject of English in Germany. Yes, you have it in school. But I wonder how many people speak English enough to understand it (in conversations, films, books).

The inability of the English language always reflects the arrogance of the respective people. The more arrogant a people, the worse their English skills.
(The same applies to English-speaking peoples whose inability to learn other languages.)

Well, in Europe you don't speak the same language everywhere, English only in England. And I think you overestimate the English-speaking German population, I am always amazed how many DE can not speak English. Holland or Scandinavian countries, on the other hand, speak much better English than Germans, in Denmark or Holland many even speak German. This is not only due to the education system, television is also mostly not synchronized with foreign broadcasts. How many Germans speak Dutch or Danish? In my opinion, DE is not a positive benchmark for foreign language skills. Spain and France are of course extremely negative examples. France in particular is characterized by linguistic arrogance, not only the unwillingness to learn foreign languages, even the will to want to understand French-speaking foreigners. In other countries one reacts extremely positively when foreigners (tourists) at least try the national language, in France they are punished with ignoring it. On the other hand, it is always embarrassing that Germans in Spain cannot even say "Hello" or "Bye" in Spanish. If you're lucky, you'll have enough "cerveza" ...

(The above text reflects my personal opinion, based on personal experiences abroad :))

Then I compare the whole thing with the Nordic countries, especially Sweden - the boys there can all speak English at a super-high level ..

If I go over the border to Amsterdam .. everyone can speak English there ..

In these two countries, a number of films, series, etc. are also broadcast in the original (i.e. in English) because a Syncro is not worthwhile for a few million Hanseln. This automatically leads to people becoming better at English if they deal with it on a daily basis. In the case of Holland, there is also the fact that the language is a mixture of German and English anyway, so it is very close together.

Swedish and German, like English, are also Germanic languages, which is why we feel - apart from the pronunciation - overall easier than people from the Romance language stock (French, Spanish, Italian). Nonetheless, I agree with you that the French, but also the Spanish, show an astonishing arrogance when it comes to learning foreign languages.

After all, there is hardly any will ... to deepen the existing knowledge. I also have younger colleagues who ask me on the "usual social websites" why I write in English ... because I also have English-speaking friends ... -.-

the syncro is definitely an argument, after my last vacation in Portugal I found two-and-half-man really good;)

on the other hand, the proximity of one's own language to English is certainly also a point of whether it is easier to learn. The English of the Spaniards at work always sounds like a mixture of Spanish and English ... Intonation totally wrong. Only the Indians are worse, I don't understand much.

After all, there is hardly any will ... to deepen the existing knowledge. I also have younger colleagues who ask me on the "usual social websites" why I write in English ... because I also have English-speaking friends ... -.- I don't understand IT people who prefer their programs and tools in German than use in original English. Technical terms and expressions are partly translated into incomprehensible translations, research on the Internet is made considerably more difficult, documentation is often only in English, etc. I always have the problem that my colleague asks me where he can find something and I explain it to him on the English interface, which he can't find in German.

on the other hand, the proximity of one's own language to English is certainly also a point of whether it is easier to learn. The English of the Spaniards at work always sounds like a mixture of Spanish and English ... Intonation totally wrong. Only the Indians are worse, I don't understand much. As the eye has already written, Spanish is a completely different sounding language than English. English, which is pronounced German, is also legendary. I only say "sen se men". optionally also "den de men"

In Spain you can also afford this "arrogance", as around 500 million people speak Spanish. Not in Iceland, Norway or the Netherlands. No pig speaks their languages, so they adapt to the others if they don't want to live completely isolated.

In these two countries, a number of films, series, etc. are also broadcast in the original (i.e. in English) because a Syncro is not worthwhile for a few million Hanseln.

that's the way it is. This is one of the reasons why many in Scandinavia speak English quite well. but when i read germany here i can only smile tiredly. what most Germans know as "English" has little to do with English.
The worst thing is when politicians can't speak English. In contrast to many other professional groups who hardly or never need English, that's damn part of their job.

The worst thing is when politicians can't speak English. In contrast to many other professional groups who hardly or never need English, that's damn part of their job.

What. Already fits.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bGKfvBG9sM

: D

I prefer this situation there to the one here in Germany: Why do local Germans speak German so badly?



At least in the tourist strongholds during the season you can actually find a Spaniard for every language who speaks it ... sometimes more bad than right, but many different languages.

therefore I also make a distinction between "reading / understanding English" and "speaking English" ... on the one hand there is the problem of "thinking German -> translating 1: 1 -> hope that it fits" and on the other hand there is a lack of vocabulary with can read every now and then skip: D

In Spain you can also afford this "arrogance", as around 500 million people speak Spanish.
Yes, is the 4th most common and masterfully learned language in the world.

With regard to Germany, one shouldn't forget the influence of the occupying powers after WWII: Ossis learned Russian, Wessis English. Spain and France didn't have to give up.

in France the language is consciously promoted. http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loi_Toubon
There was something like that in Germany before WWII as well: German terms were invented for common words such as "Allvoran" instead of "General".
Unfortunately, I can't think of what slogan it was under.

So the Spaniards I deal with speak English as well as I do. Of course, people who deal with me are more internationally oriented than the average Spaniard - it doesn't do anything to exhibit in Germany and only be able to speak Spanish.

Yes, is the 4th most common and masterfully learned language in the world.

Serious question; what else is there

English
Chinese
Hindi (or whatever Indian language)
Spanish

???

Ok, wiki says this

Among the most widely spoken languages ​​in the world, Hindi ranks second after Chinese and ahead of Spanish and English

But then this is the native speaker list. I am sure that more people can speak English than Chinese.

When I look at train staff, taxi drivers, cashiers in the average big city ... well, I don't know whether this is so different in D - from the visitor's point of view.

But then this is the native speaker list. I am sure that more people can speak English than Chinese.
There is no other way to grasp it. Because "ability" is a matter of interpretation.
Wiki also has ~ 350 million native English speakers and then the small range of 350-1000 million with English as a second language - but we're back to our skills here.

And correct, English was considered important here far too late.

Some native speakers cannot speak their own language either. All I have to do is look around the forum. : ulol:

The native-speaking Spaniards live in the south - that is, where you want to leave quickly because it's not exactly tingling. Anyone who came to Spain from Gibraltar was reminded of the US-Mexico border.

The majority of Spaniards do not speak Spanish as their mother tongue at the same time - that was sometimes the case in the Middle Ages. As a first foreign language they have to learn something else - the official language. English is then only the second foreign language and therefore mostly available,
as with you Germans, for example. the French - not at all. But the EU is doing little to bring minority protection closer to the rulers in Madrid ...

Aja - and in France almost everyone speaks English - whether the residents show that is a different story.

Take a look around here in D. My in Bavaria or where do you get along well with the locals with English? Don't think so

Don't get along well with English anywhere else if you're not addressing younger people. And even with many young people it is a problem. I see it often enough with my colleagues.

Exactly, it's no different here either. Most of them get the blush on their faces when they are supposed to dig out their school English.

It is due to the sometimes weak English lessons and the lack of willingness to learn. A colleague of mine, now 19 years old, once said: "Why can you speak English, everyone can speak German" until she once had an American patient and started swimming.
A Brit once asked me in town for directions to the hotel and was overjoyed because I was probably the 10th person he spoke to and nobody could help him beforehand.

But then this is the native speaker list. I am sure that more people can speak English than Chinese.
That is not tenable because the correctness of the claim depends entirely on what you define as English. Do you know African English? It is also English, but you will only understand fragments of words. In addition, you still have to define "can": Do you mean to speak or understand?

Everything is as easy as you can see.

For people with a Romance language as their mother tongue, English has a very high level of difficulty. It has nothing to do with arrogance.

So the Spaniards I deal with speak English as well as I do, so your English skills can't be far off. ;)

Actually, I only dealt with Spaniards (students) during my studies. Their English was difficult to understand.
As far as I know, Spanish is actually the language of Castile, the central region around Madrid.
As a first foreign language they have to learn something else - the official language. English is then only the second foreign language and therefore mostly available,
as with you Germans, for example. the French - not at all. But the EU is doing little to bring minority protection closer to the rulers in Madrid ... Actually, German is the first foreign language for dialect speakers and not English. The fact that people in Germany speak of dialects and not languages ​​is of a political nature. You can see that very well in Dutch. Dutch is linguistically much closer to the North German dialects than North German dialects to South German dialects. A good criterion for distinguishing between language and dialect is usually mutual intelligibility. If two speakers can no longer converse because the linguistic differences are too great, one speaks of two languages. If you look at a Bavarian and a Low German speaker according to the criterion, for example, you will see that you cannot actually speak of dialects.

Well, in Europe you don't speak the same language everywhere, English only in England. And I think you overestimate the English-speaking German population, I am always amazed how many DE can not speak English. Holland or Scandinavian countries, on the other hand, speak much better English than the Germans, in Denmark or Holland many even speak German. This is not only due to the education system, television is also usually not synchronized with foreign broadcasts. How many Germans speak Dutch or Danish? In my opinion, DE is not a positive benchmark for foreign language skills. Spain and France are of course extremely negative examples. France in particular is characterized by linguistic arrogance, not only the unwillingness to learn foreign languages, even the will to want to understand French-speaking foreigners. In other countries one reacts extremely positively when foreigners (tourists) at least try the national language, in France they are punished with ignoring it. On the other hand, it is always embarrassing that Germans in Spain cannot even say "Hello" or "Bye" in Spanish. If you're lucky, you'll have enough "cerveza" ...

(The above text reflects my personal opinion, based on personal experiences abroad :))

Even French students abroad speak poor English. This does not apply to Germans, Dutch, Scandinavians, but also Russians, Turks or Poles.

If you feel the need to consume and understand certain books and films that are either not available at all or are much more expensive in the local language ... there is only one solution: study and work on yourself. Very often, however, the satisfaction with what you can get is greater. But I don't want to miss the opportunity to experience extraordinary media. At the moment I'm reading Mike Foley's Autobio ... it's not available in German :)

Even French students abroad speak poor English. This does not apply to Germans, Dutch, Scandinavians, but also Russians, Turks or Poles.

Well, especially in Poland, you can make better progress with "learned 5 minutes ago" than with English. But many speak German there too. A country further north-east, Lithuania, it looks fabulous again with English (applies to the whole of the Baltic States, imo)

For me, a good command of English has become much less important since a stay in England. Was the first time that I had real communication problems, because they speak a different dialect every 20km.

Before you start talking about arrogance and similar things, you should at least be aware of the Spanish subject that during the Franco dictatorship, English and other foreign languages ​​were not on the curriculum. It takes a while for the system to slowly return to normal. If you have never learned English, then there are accordingly no qualified teachers, or too few of them, so that of course even the younger generation still suffers from it and consequently speaks little English.

Well, understanding and speaking are two different construction sites.

It is possible that you understand English wonderfully, but you have difficulties speaking. One two short and it goes off like nothing with the English.

Hello!

I would like to comment on this topic here because I have dealt with it relatively. My name is Francisco, I come from Mexico and have been living in Germany for two years. So I'm a Spanish speaking person. During my stay in the land of thinkers and poets, I have often heard statements such as "the Dutch are very good at English" or "that is because they only have subtitles in the cinema, not as we Germans dub like all films". You think the Dutch and people from Scandinavia are some kind of language genius. But the reality is very different. The Dutch, Swedes or Danes have a Germanic mother tongue. To a Norwegian, the verb "stand up" sounds similar to "stå opp", which means "stand up" in Norwegian.In Spanish, on the other hand, we say "levántate" ... so it's completely different. For a Spaniard there is no association between "stand up" and "levantarse". In short: while the Norwegian or German already has a general, morphological or phonetic basic vocabulary with English, a Spaniard or Italian has to start from scratch.

For us, however, Italian, French or Portuguese are the easiest languages ​​to learn. If Latin were still the world language, Spaniards, French and Italians would be the best speakers anywhere, while English, Scandinavians or Germans would have great difficulty communicating in this language.

It is also not true that the Spanish do not learn another language because they are proud or consider their language to be "the world language". The truth is, they'd love to know English, but it's very difficult for them, in Mexico we're in the same situation. All young people love English because of movies or music, but hardly anybody can speak it. Although we have at least 6 years of language lessons in school and have numerous language schools and textbooks. In addition, we often do not synchronize the latest films. And yet we can barely understand English. So these non-dubbed films = good English theory is unfortunately just an illusion. As I said, the Dutch or other Europeans can speak English well because they have a Germanic mother tongue. I can speak English well myself because I am addicted to games (I have been playing video games for over 20 years and they are mostly in English without subtitles), otherwise I would understand this language very little.

I have also confirmed my theory in other countries. I have been living in Poland for 6 months, in a city not so far from Ukraine. And to my surprise, the Poles don't speak English either, whether they're old or 15. Sure, the younger ones might be able to build up a few sentences like "i am 15 years old" or something like that, but not more. At the train station, on the bus, anywhere, no matter where you try, it's like the people here have never heard English in their entire lives. Strangely, films in the cinema are not synchronized. And English can also be heard everywhere on the radio. But you don't understand. Because I am a relatively linguistically gifted person, I have no problems because I can speak the language on a communicative level (but with a lot of mistakes). Otherwise it would be really difficult. And I talked to many Poles about it. She also had English in school. But that didn't do much. I am also learning Russian here and am the only one who is not Polish in my language course. To my surprise, the Tolstoy language is not a problem at all for my fellow students. Names for body parts, jobs, numbers and other details are so similar to Polish that they rarely need a dictionary for them while I rack my brains. But well, German was difficult for me at the beginning, so I'm already a passionate masochist;)

Just to add: I also got to know Ukrainians, Slovaks and Russians here, and these people really don't speak English either. On the other hand, they speak Polish very well (better than mine) because of the similarity between Slavic languages.


In summary: Whether English is actually "the world language" remains controversial. Sure, it can be found everywhere in the media, but certainly the only people who can master this language quickly are only Germans, Dutch or Scandinavians. The rest of the world will always have trouble with this.

We might ask ourselves the following question: Would the Romans have liked to learn English? I think for them the Saxons and their languages ​​were just "barbarians". Maybe Spanish, Italian and French as daughter languages ​​of Latin have a "natural" rejection of English;)

Second: You Germans can speak a lot of English, in my opinion. Really! You can understand at least one song text, and that's a lot! In Latin America, Spain or Eastern Europe, people only enjoy the melody but don't know what it is about. So be happy !! =)

Third: In order to become really "international", one should learn at least one Romance, one Germanic, one Slavic and one Asian language. And you should learn the language where you want to live, whether that's only for a few months. Why communicate with the Spanish in English? You should put in a little more effort and actually learn Spanish, whether with mistakes or not. Or do you also have "integration problems" abroad? ;)

English is also unnecessary for most Germans. Even as an IT specialist, I can't score with English. I have now worked in 4 companies, English was not a factor in any of them.
During my training, I also worked with 7 media designers (digital and print, Photoshop, web design, etc.). All of them did internships in different companies. Nowhere was English important.

The fairy tale that English is incredibly important has been told for at least 20 years. Sensible German is a thousand times more important. And that, as is well known, fails with many students.

@ mapel110
Without English, a computer scientist can hardly or not at all have access to a lot of information, etc.
Almost every problem you have had someone else. Notes on error messages can also be found much faster
Really up-to-date software, books and tutorials are only available in English.
We also make our software multilingual in German and English. We also make comments in English.

@ mapel110
Without English, a computer scientist can hardly or not at all have access to a lot of information, etc.
Almost every problem you have had someone else. Notes on error messages can also be found much faster
Really up-to-date software, books and tutorials are also practically only available in English.
We also make our software multilingual in German and English. We also make comments in English.
Company size, customers and type of programs just play a role. So far I have only been to small companies with exclusively German customers. And so English has never played a role. The problems that arose could almost always be solved with sources from German-speaking countries, or it was enough to think about sample codes and to know one or the other English command.

German itself played a far greater role. Formulate the specifications, documentation, comments, etc. in such a way that someone other than you can understand them. ^^
I have a reasonable command of English, but if I imagine that I had to translate all of this with the necessary precision, I would not be able to do it even after 5 years. That's hard enough in German.

the spanish are too proud for that. i also experienced something like this when i shared a flat with someone in lisbon. the communication was limited to good morning, ok, good bye .. in bairro alto (extremely dense, overcrowded party area, almost English-speaking) everyone stands / drinks / celebrates with everyone and next to them the spanish people.
meanwhile the portuguese almost all speak excellent english. is because foreign or cinema films and series are not synchronized: D

ps .: the franzacken are also too proud. the best thing to do is to steer clear of these countries.

ps2: one of the main reasons is, of course, that italians, spanish and portuguese can more or less communicate in their languages. no english is needed in this context. However, the franzacken are already excluded and actually remain completely to themselves.

What strikes me every time there is that the locals, regardless of whether they are 16 or 66, have absolutely no or very poor knowledge of English. Yes. I also feel as good as NO RUMANISH at all in German and I have to fight with the German spelling. Impossible like that: freak:

Why is that Here in Germany, English can already be learned in elementary school .... Because Germany is not everywhere and PATRIOTISM is different, the locals do not want to alienate their language and culture.

It's amazing how badly it fails because of European integration in language :(
That has nothing to do with European integration. Just because England is in the EU doesn't mean that we all have to speak English.
Romania is also in the EU and almost no one speaks English there.

I really don't know where your problem is. : rolleyes:

Could it be that all Germans on vacation didn't get the "I AM CUSTOMER KING" red carpet laid out and are a bit frustrated because of it? : biggrin:

PS:

Very interesting to watch that in the whole EU, the only thing permanent about such lapalia complaining are the Germans.
Why do other nations not come with it?
That would be the question of what you should ask yourself and not why the locals in countries X or Y do not speak a language that corresponds to your wishes.

yes, romanian is practically a second world language, right after english.

Just because England is in the EU doesn't mean we all have to speak English for a long time. The influences are probably mainly from America.
Company size, customers and type of programs just play a role. So far I have only been to small companies with exclusively German customers. And so English has never played a role. The problems that arose could almost always be solved with sources from German-speaking countries, or it was enough to think about sample codes and to know one or the other English command.

German itself played a far greater role. Formulate the specifications, documentation, comments, etc. in such a way that someone other than you can understand them. ^^
I have a reasonable command of English, but if I imagine that I had to translate all of this with the necessary precision, I would not be able to do it even after 5 years. That's hard enough in German, and we're not that big either. We now mainly make products and at least we have customers in the Netherlands, France and Switzerland.
A part is also sold worldwide by another company.

The USA was "invented" by Europe: tongue:
I think it was more the influences of the British Empire in the 19th century that made English the "world language".

Most of the influences come from America, and that's why we have to master English in the EU, no? : freak:
Is the USA in the EU or have I missed something? : biggrin:

yes, Romanian is a second world language, right after English. Can it be that you didn't understand my "irony" about being the start report? : freak:

I am learning the languages ​​from which I have the most advantages. Why should I learn something that I don't need?

English is worthwhile for films and books from English-speaking countries. German, because that's the main language here now. If I were interested in the original French texts, I would learn that.

actually one should approach these things a little more pragmatically.

Multilingualism is part of who you are traveling or who are all field workers in foreign countries, otherwise you can bend.

Coming back to the main topic:

Sorry but only because Germans like to vacation in spain, where they have built up a bunch of roaring Saufer settlements, does not mean for a long time that Spaniards have to master German or, alternatively, English and if that doesn't suit the spoiled German ballermann drunkard, then they shouldn't go there to fly. Nobody is obliged to do so.

Films and books in original sound. Point.

yes, romanian is practically a second world language, right after english.
First of all, if you are often on construction sites, you should be able to speak Polish.
This will get you the furthest. : D
In Poland you should speak RU if you want to understand something on the construction site.



Sorry but only because Germans like to vacation in spain, where they have built up a bunch of roaring Saufer settlements, does not mean for a long time that Spaniards have to master German or, alternatively, English and if that doesn't suit the spoiled German ballermann drunkard, then they shouldn't go there to fly. Nobody is obliged to do so.
Uh, especially in Mallorca you can get very far with German.
So the example is actually very inappropriate.

Films and books in original sound. Point.
I've been doing it for a lifetime. If I don't understand something, then read along with the translation.
Since you have just addressed the topic, for example in Romania and on TV, there is only original sound with subtitle translation and at least I've been used to it for a lifetime and hate like the plague these idiotic synchronized translations where I instead of voice the original, the blued one from the Oly Poher has to hear or knows who else. Nene .... No need.

@ Morale

You probably forgot the CIRILIAN WRITING because without pecking stupidly from the laundry who you have papers from them in front of your nose.

What? I haven't read everything ... but here in Germany over 30s speak English - only a very small amount of English. We Germans are the stupidest thing in the world when it comes to languages.

@ Morals

You probably forgot the CIRILIAN SCRIPTURE because without pecking stupidly from the laundry who you have papers from them in front of your nose.
Well, most of the Poles work here for (mostly East) German companies (1 East German foreman, the rest Polish people without knowledge of German. So cool 2 years ago, tiler, I said to him, "Is that dry?" Of course, he couldn't speak German, so I did in and then TILE SURFING; D. When Ossi arrives and complains, I first rounded him up), so I have papers in German, someone had miscounted the RU in PL, they will surely have Polish documents then.

Only Eastern companies with PL employees? LOCKED OUT! : biggrin:

Come to DUISBURG and there you will learn fluent Polish.
In Bavaria you will learn Romanian fluently because it is full of workers from Romania and Romanian construction companies.

Even in Spain, these strawberry pickers are 99% Romanians.

Well most of the time the foreman can speak halfway German.
And here are many companies from the east that come here quickly from Saxony.
Of course Romanians too.
Most of the time you don't want to save so much on "quality" and then give the order to a "German" company.

I am learning the languages ​​from which I have the most advantages. Why should I learn something that I don't need?



Are you serious? I thought that as a book author and a guy with a general interest in the fine arts, you can learn a language that you just find beautiful.

There is no other way to grasp it. Because "ability" is a matter of interpretation.
Wiki also has ~ 350 million native English speakers and then the small range of 350-1000 million with English as a second language - but we're back to our skills here.

And correct, English was considered important here far too late.

Isn't English taught from 1st grade onwards?

What? I haven't read everything ... but here in Germany over 30s speak English - only a very small amount of English. These are the ones that the occupation troops caught before 1990 and with whom strictly to deal.We Germans are, when it comes to languages, the stupidest thing in the world.Because Germans are already so spoiled and others learn their language in order to communicate with them so he could be lazy and learn nothing.

@ Morale

The quality is more of a prejudice. Eastern bloc companies / employees can deliver the same quality provided that the same materials are used as the western companies / employees.

Where there is a problem with them, punctuality, work rhythm and reliability in terms of workplace retention and working hours compliance.

Whom the z: b. Wants a cigarette break, or something to eat, then he takes a break.
That is your work program or break program Sch *** s No matter who gets bloated in the evening, the next day he sleeps off without reporting and not like the German what the work stops for a second based on the given break time and starts again exactly and whoever he fajert in the evening, the next day crawls to work on all fours "in the interests of the company".

@ CyberCSX
for me that is part of the quality;)
I mean, what use is it if they work well but need 2 weeks longer.
I'm currently on a major construction site and always had to chase after the electricians. Are from Kehlheim but 90% Poles.
They will definitely not get the full amount of money because they are so late.
As cool as we have been charging them 100+ hours in the last few weeks because we couldn't do anything.
And the toilets are always nice brown on the walls of them; D

They're only used to having an outhouse.
High tech isn't.

Give them a bush in the backyard with a hole in the ground and they are happy, and you don't have to scrape shit off the walls either. : biggrin:

Isn't English taught from 1st grade onwards? Yes, it has, but it has only been for a few years. Of course it starts with songs and "good morning" and stuff like that. Learning English properly is not there yet. I have no idea when this really starts, my son is in the first one. But he's so excited about learning (yes, he's a nerdy) that he also gets Spanish from me. : biggrin:

@ jorge42

Be glad that you have a child who is interested in learning and also has the appropriate IQ to get everything baked because most of them are overwhelmed with it and at some point they even write German even worse everything I come from abroad.

@ jorge42

Be glad that you have a child who is interested in learning and also has the appropriate IQ to get everything baked, yes that's me really.

But I'm also happy that my child is not gifted. I was able to experience this a little with acquaintances, a 3 year old who can read and asks questions that the parents cannot answer and then becomes behavioral at school. : frown:

I was able to experience this a little with acquaintances, a 3 year old who can read and asks questions that the parents cannot answer and then becomes behavioral at school. : frown:
That is exactly a risky social problem.
Those who are difficult to get going get pepped in with a learning disability and are pushed off to the edge of society and those who are highly gifted are under-challenged and are all labeled hypperactive, parents are given wrong advice, instead of asking the kids, they are droned on with psychotropic drugs until they end up in the slap and ultimately on the fringes of society.

It's really frustrating when you have a child that doesn't meet the average social FANTASY standards.

English is also unnecessary for most Germans. Even as an IT specialist, I can't score with English. I have now worked in 4 companies, English was not a factor in any of them.
During my training, I also worked with 7 media designers (digital and print, Photoshop, web design, etc.). All of them did internships in different companies. Nowhere was English important.

The fairy tale that English is incredibly important has been told for at least 20 years. Sensible German is a thousand times more important. And that, as is well known, fails with many students.


If you take a look at job offers in major newspapers or online, then well over 50% of the advertisements say that the applicant should have good to very good knowledge of English, sometimes not only in language but also in writing.
And not always only for very large companies that z. B. are internationally active, but also many small companies "require" this in the meantime.
That is very noticeable to me.

Basically that's true, but if you look at it soberly: Would you ask your IT specialist in-house to write a business letter for customer XY?

If you are employed in electronics, English is essential. All component data sheets are in English. Many semiconductor manufacturers come from the USA. In this area, English has simply prevailed, similar to Latin in medicine. Without English, you can be put in a coffin right away.

Most programming languages ​​are also based on English. Why is it complicated to rethink to another language here?

You need English in technology. It's so. You can't get around it. That is why there are no Spanish or French semiconductor manufacturers that are internationally successful. But they are suppliers who are locally successful in their country.

The French and Spaniards see this as national pride, but only stand in their own way. But here, too, there are exceptions who speak good English.

In general, I am of the opinion that if you intend to settle in a foreign country, you should learn the local language. Of course, this does not apply to holidays. This is what I expect from myself when I move to Spain, as well as from an Englishman who comes to Austria (and in my example, after 8 years, still cannot speak German).

Greetings,
Zeph

Basically that's true, but if you look at it soberly: Would you ask your computer scientist in-house to write a business letter for customer XY?


If my employees don't speak English and I have to act as the translator every time because of minor issues, then I ask the next employee to be able to speak English.
Even if it is just to explain to the customer on the phone that he has to turn on his monitor separately!

If you take a look at job offers in major newspapers or online, then well over 50% of the advertisements say that the applicant should have good to very good knowledge of English, sometimes not only in language but also in writing.
And not always only for very large companies that z. B. are internationally active, but also many small companies "require" this in the meantime.
That's very noticeable to me, yes. This happens because over 80% of the ads are FAKE.

The German politicians (labor ministers) OBLIGATE entrepreneurs to create jobs in the devil, which is simply not possible. In order to be off the hook, advertise job offers that are so tight that almost no one reports because the potential employee is not up to the requirements.

If the company is now held responsible, the following statement is made:

- WE have created jobs, are looking for staff, but nobody answers!

and so are those from the tailors and have their peace.

For example, I have seen advertisements where HAUSMEISTER is searched for. Apart from the fact that the job in English is all FACILITY MANAGER, which in turn is just sick shit because we are here in Germany and not in the pampas of the USA or England, such requirements are made that no pig reports here and the notification comes from one FA was Sozi apartments to rent in the Düsseldorf area and where usually Any retirees work what hardly knows German and only put out the garbage and otherwise mostly twiddle around.

In addition to a driver's license for cars and trucks, the demand also includes training in at least 5 to 8 professions (electrical fitter, locksmith, painter and painter, air conditioning technician, automotive mechatronics technician) with at least 10 years of professional experience in all professions, language skills in spoken and written ENGLISH , GERMAN and FRENCH, 24 hour standby, OWN CAR, etc.

But hello, are you still okay?
It is clear that with such sick reports no pig reports. Anyone who has 10 years of professional experience in 5 professions at the same time, speaks 3 languages ​​fluently, is willing to sacrifice their free time, family, children for 24 hours on call and use their own car and company car and even bear the costs of such a NECK CUTTER underpaid?

It is already clear that such reports are a FAKE legal requirement and do not display real ones.

As far as the IT profession is concerned, I really don't know WHY it is written in English because usually. the programming languages ​​are not english, no matter if php, cgi, c ++, paskal or whatever.

English is only necessary for system administrators who have to do with non-German language software / systems.

I don't know, but I don't think that much of the ads are fake.
I could rather imagine that the requirements are sometimes intentionally set so high that with a few compromises with the applicant, a reasonable employee comes across.

That is exactly a risky social problem.
Those who are difficult to get going get pepped in with a learning disability and are pushed off to the edge of society and those who are highly gifted are under-challenged and are all labeled hypperactive, parents are given wrong advice, instead of asking the kids, they are droned on with psychotropic drugs until they end up in the slap and ultimately on the fringes of society.

It's really frustrating when you have a child that doesn't meet the average social FANTASY standards.

You speak from my soul, that's exactly how the rabbit runs today. :(
It's crazy what some parents do to their children.
I really believe that some parents are proud when their child has as many diseases, disabilities and disorders as possible.

So I'm not surprised that health insurance costs keep exploding. All this job creation madness has to be financed.

@ Bubba2k3

If that is the case, it is more of a deterrent and you don't even apply for it.

Another example, my son's girlfriend wanted to do a part-time job as cleaning / toilet attendant. Imagine that she told her on the phone that she needed a POLICE EXECUTION CERTIFICATE and she should apply for SCHUFA INFORMATION to prove that she is SCHUFA FREE. I overheard the conversation afterwards I just told her, HANG UP !!!

That can't be true that you ask something like that from a plaster which should clean in the Duisburg Forum and opposite in the City Palast: mad:

24 hours later I went there and asked a cleaner what was wiping around there and she told me that none is being set here, on the contrary, 7 posts are being abolished.

In the meantime, jobseekers are only being ripped off by the line and by the thread, from the cleaner to the bank manager.

@ Wurschtler

You’re wrong because the parents are usually wrong. have no idea what is going on, are in panic and are just pissed off and misled by the learning staff in the schools. You can only feel sorry for them and HELP whoever you can.

A learner what it has to do with a hipster is overwhelmed and wants to get rid of him because he is simply TOO STUPID and then he tries to talk everyone out and the first tip what is given to the parents, GO TO THE PSIHIATER and that's wrong.

The first thing you have to do is an IQ test and from the NEUROLOGER to do an ELECTRO ENCEPHALOGRAM to see how the nerve currents in the brain work. Are the over / higher alls the average (in percentages) he is not hipper active but highly talented and then what the stuff holds must be promoted so that he is busy.

The same tests should also be done with something that comes slower to tour and only then reacts accordingly.

Apart from all this, the child should go to a doctor who knows his or her mother tongue. Tests with e.g. a Turkish or Polish child at a German doctor backfires and the probability of a misdiagnosis due to a lack of communication is much higher.

I'm writing this from personal experience. While my son (now 28) was classified as hipper-active because he was underchallenged, my daughter (now 25) was classified as having a learning disability because she made it a little difficult and is a mutist.
MUTIST are those who don't like to speak and have very big problems who they have to give lectures in school.

I understand English far better than I speak it, although I can make myself understood and I simply lack the language practice.

Last autumn on vacation in Denmark, I basically spoke to the Danes in English and asked whether they spoke German or English. Here it was so that a good 50/50 answered each time. In any case, what surprised me very positively was the fact that people in Denmark are much more relaxed about language. No matter if young or old.
Here in Ffm I only ever experience two examples.
The "Germans" who don't want to speak any other language or who speak it perfectly.

@ Wurschtler

You’re wrong because the parents are usually wrong. have no idea what is going on, are in panic and are just pissed off and misled by the learning staff in the schools. You can only feel sorry for them and HELP whoever you can.


Sure, others are to blame as well, but ultimately parents are responsible for what happens to their children. Thus, they are also complicit in allowing their children to be tormented with such things.

I am well aware that there are parents who are happy that their children are sick or that they are all sick and that they use the opportunity as much as possible to achieve social benefits and social privileges. but not all are like that.

As for English, I learned it for 10 years and can speak it very well. Even in Moscow I got along very well with it, but with the writing it is huge, even worse than with the German because I write almost no English at all. Don't have where and with whom.

As far as the IT profession is concerned, I really don't know WHY it is written in English because usually. the programming languages ​​are not english, no matter if php, cgi, c ++, paskal or whatever.

English is only necessary for system administrators who have to do with non-German language software / systems.
First of all, the programming languages ​​are based on English (for loops, while loops, switch / case distributors, etc.) and then almost all good literature in computer science is in English and on the Internet you will find out about computer science (especially when programming ) almost only communicated in English.

In what I agree with you, however, is that as a computer scientist in D it is usually enough to be able to read English reasonably well.


If my employees can't speak English and I have to act as the translator every time because of little things, then I ask the next employee to be able to speak English.
Even if it is only to explain to the customer on the phone that he has to switch on his monitor separately!
Well ... the IT specialists in our company speak 90% better English than sales / support, but they would never let us call a customer voluntarily because we are far too honest and usually far too direct.

The few vocabulary used in programming and in the computer industry cannot be described as "being able to speak a foreign language". Every English 5-class candidate can do that if he is interested in the subject.

Today, many write "English" in their application, even though they only have poor knowledge. And people are still taken if they can program well and create proper (German) documentation. That's enough for the companies I've worked for up to now. There were never any foreign contacts.
And I don't think these companies are the big exception in Germany.

Aja - and in France almost everyone speaks English - whether the residents show that is a different story.

Yes, I know a few French too ... first they speak French until they notice that I don't know a word now, and then put in the broadest Bernese dialect that they could actually speak German too ... ; D

All well and good, but I still can't find the answer why the farmer from spain has to speak english when the german visits his farm or the farmer from romania whom the german count dracula's birthplace in transylvania visits? : rolleyes:

All well and good, but I still can't find the answer why the farmer from spain has to speak english when the german visits his farm or the farmer from romania whom the german count dracula's birthplace in transylvania visits? : rolleyes:

If it were possible for the angry German to push his way through, the poor Spanish / Romanian farmer would have to be able to speak German. This is how the English / US-Americans handle it, because they usually only know one language ...
See it: English is accepted as a "world language". Be happy - I am sure: you will find it easier to learn English than, for example, Chinese or Indian: D

See it: English is accepted as a "world language". Be glad - I am sure: you will find it easier to learn English than, for example, Chinese or Indian: I did not say anything else and I agree with you.

Nevertheless, you have to be understanding and understand that you can't ask everyone behind the scenes, what shovels cow dung in the backyard, to master a world language just because you visit your country to relax, or whatever, and still have a grasp on it do. : wink:

It is no different in Germany either.

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